tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post6106653078622576219..comments2024-01-27T06:40:41.709-05:00Comments on def shepherd: Bullied Teen Jamie Hubley's Catholic Funeraleshephttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03484081625693013559noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-5371939865617272102011-11-07T08:11:37.150-05:002011-11-07T08:11:37.150-05:00All excellent points, eshep ... I can only concur;...All excellent points, eshep ... I can only concur; religion doesn't kill LGBT kids, but it does create people who do.Rant In A-Minorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01195240480169539608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-25167546738653836152011-10-20T09:06:42.969-04:002011-10-20T09:06:42.969-04:00Fact: Religion-based bigotry is a problem
See:
h...Fact: Religion-based bigotry is a problem <br /><br />See:<br />http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rev-dr-cindi-love/bullying-bullicidewho-is-_b_744519.html<br /><br />http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130837802<br /><br />http://www.child-psych.org/2010/10/special-editorial-bullying-gay-teen-suicides-and-a-need-for-a-solution.html<br /><br />http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/50518515-76/americans-church-faith-gave.html.csp?page=2<br /><br />A Google search will turn up any number of studies, news stories, etc. dealing with the connection between religion and anti-LGBT ideology and bullying: http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1CHKZ_enUS440US440&gcx=w&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=examples+of+religion+based+bullying#sclient=psy-ab&hl=en&rlz=1C1CHKZ_enUS440US440&source=hp&q=religion+based+bullying+homosexual&pbx=1&oq=religion+based+bullying+homosexual&aq=f&aqi=&aql=1&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=996977l996977l1l997657l1l1l0l0l0l0l280l280l2-1l1l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.,cf.osb&fp=b571422ac7922aeb&biw=1280&bih=653<br /><br />It's important to note that, often, bullies themselves are not aware of the connection. But the anti-LGBT religious messages that have been perpetuated throughout history, and currently in churches, religious literature, religious talk shows, etc. are complicit in validating anti-LGBT ideology and bullying. The hateful speech that comes from the AFA, FRC, Focus on the Family, etc. (along with our political leaders' validation via association with these groups) serves only to encourage and condone anti-LGBT ideology and bullying.<br /><br />What I am stating here is that, yes, religious institutions, and yes, the Roman Catholic Church, through their long histories of condemning homosexuality as a sinful abomination worthy of eternal hellfire and damnation, have indirectly contributed to the rampant anti-LGBT ideology which has led to the suicides of bullied gay teens.<br /><br />Did the church punch the kid in the face, spit in his food, or call him a 'faggot?' Of course not.<br /><br />Can a child who grows up in a household of spousal abuse end up abusing his own spouse? Yes. Did the behavior in his house contribute to his own violent and abusive behavior? Absolutely.<br /><br />I don't believe that I can convince you that religion's long history of condemnation of homosexuality has contributed to the attitudes we see today. It's there in black and white. It's in the scripture. The words are spoken from the pulpit every sunday. (At all churches, and by all religious people? Hardly.) Religious organizations speak it at national events on a regular basis. <br /><br />How, I ask you, is this *not* influencing ideology?eshephttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03484081625693013559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-12910348112380219862011-10-20T09:06:28.264-04:002011-10-20T09:06:28.264-04:00First of all, your comments are entirely welcome. ...First of all, your comments are entirely welcome. Anyone's are (with the exception of one comment that was hate speech, I have never deleted any comments, no matter how challenging or antagonistic). <br /><br />I engage every day with people who challenge my beliefs. I welcome it, and would not have it any other way.<br /><br />Re: your point that bullying has nothing to do with religion. You are correct that much bullying occurs that has no religious basis at all. I, too, was bullied, and it had nothing to do with religion. It was the fact that I was skinny, not athletic, interested in music and art, and an easy target. I do not for a minute deny that bullying occurs that has no root in religion.<br /><br />All that being said, you fail to understand that there is nothing in the bible that states that being skinny and weak is an abomination. <br /><br />Leviticus 20:13 does not state, "If a man plays the piano instead of football, he has done what is detestable. He must be put to death; His blood will be on their own heads."<br />1 Corinthians 6:9-11 does not say, "Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor skinny kids who look different and like to draw, nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."<br /><br />Just because you and I are heterosexuals who were bullied as teens does not mean that religious-based bullying of homosexuals does not exist. That logic does not hold up.<br /><br />Just because someone bullies a gay teen, and never mentions the name of Jesus while they are getting beat up, does not mean that religion did not play a role in their actions, directly or indirectly.<br /><br />(con't)eshephttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03484081625693013559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-91265445529988424112011-10-20T08:08:46.946-04:002011-10-20T08:08:46.946-04:00Prove to me that it is an indisputable FACT, as yo...Prove to me that it is an indisputable FACT, as you say, that the Roman Catholic Church "contributed" to this person's death. You use a lot of words to simply reiterate the statements you already made. I don't understand the purpose of your statistics on school bullying, etc. That has nothing to do with religion at all. I was bullied in school, too, as a hetero and no one brought up Jesus to my many gay friends when they were getting beat up. What made us targets was being DIFFERENT. I'M surprised I have to explain human nature and pack mentality to YOU. Ever heard of a little thing called the Holocaust? It wasn't just about being Jewish. It was about being different.<br /><br />I am also against bigotry of any kind. I just think it's way too easy, and even lazy, to keep blaming the same old groups for everything. You, and others, seem to conveniently forget the many "wrongs" of society that organized religion is NOT responsible for. I agree that there are a disproportionate amount of assholes who identify as "conservative Christians" and I will say this: I don't consider someone who behaves that way to be a Christian, that's why I'm offended to be lumped in with them.<br /><br />I started reading your blog out of interest in other viewpoints but if my comments are not welcome, no problem. Thanks for re-enforcing my suspicion that believers and non-believers are more alike than different. Most people don't like to have their thoughts challenged.Wicked Opinionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09521894394212306687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-82020529223195625912011-10-19T10:38:04.592-04:002011-10-19T10:38:04.592-04:00(con't)
As far as your statements on "Lo...(con't)<br /><br />As far as your statements on "Love the sinner, hate the sin," I would ask you this:<br />Is your family, your significant other, and your relationship with others around you part of who you are? Would you feel that your life was incomplete if you knew that you could not have a family, or marry? Your ability to accomplish these things in a way that is honest is very much a part of who you are. <br /><br />You seem to believe that I'm on some crusade to rid society of religion, just because I happen to be a non-believer. I am not. I am, however, very much against religion-based bigotry.<br /><br />That being said, I would love nothing more than to see religion evolve to the point that we do not take scripture literally. I would like to see us reach a point when we, as human beings with evolved minds and the capacity for empathy, reject the dogma that we see as harmful and archaic. We have done this with so much of scripture, yet we hang on to the anti-LGBT stuff. <br /><br />I don't apologize for anything I wrote above. You must understand that I write from the point of view of someone who does not entertain supernatural concepts. I certainly can understand how and why people do entertain them, but when these concepts and ideologies contribute to the oppression and suffering of humans, I will speak up and denounce those beliefs. <br /><br />If you have a problem with that, you may wish to read another blog. I would suggest you read some of the blogs that I mentioned above, John Shore and The God Article. However, even though they are Christian blogs, I believe you would find them equally as offensive, as they share many of the same viewpoints in regards to the culpability of religion in anti-LGBT ideology.eshephttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03484081625693013559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-49291352287423978312011-10-19T10:35:10.865-04:002011-10-19T10:35:10.865-04:00(con't) Where do these anti-LGBT attitudes com...(con't) Where do these anti-LGBT attitudes come from? <br /><br />Via 'Faith in America':<br />"Religion-based bigotry is the foundation of anti-gay attitudes in our society and in the minds of a majority of Americans, particularly persons of faith. Religion-based bigotry is not synonymous with bigotry. It is a uniquely vile form of bigotry as the prejudice, hostility and discrimination behind the words are given a moral stamp of approval."<br /><br />Via Soulforce: <br />"We recognize that oppression is most often rooted in religious belief and ideologies of power in which women, people of color and non-gender conforming (lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, intersex and queer) people are subjugated and subjected to the violence of exclusion. You will find us most often in dialogue with religious leaders, denominations and institutions who discriminate in polity, policy or practice. We are committed to decriminalization of sexual minorities by all church and state sanctioned organizations worldwide."<br /><br />I'm surprised that I even have to explain that anti-LGBT attitudes are deeply rooted in our religious ideologies. Are there other factors? Sure. But the vast majority of anti-LGBT discrimination and oppression is reinforced, and validated by (often misunderstood) scripture.<br /><br />Even Christian writers acknowledge that religion is complicit in gay teen suicides:<br /><br />http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-shore/christians-and-gay-teen-s_b_978333.html<br /><br />http://www.thegodarticle.com/7/post/2011/10/clobbering-biblical-gay-bashing.html<br /><br />This is not some far-out theory. If you are unwilling to draw any correlation, you are in denial.<br /><br />The intention of the above post was to point out how our society generally turns a blind eye to religion-based bigotry. We sweep it under the rug. We bury our gay teens in the cemeteries of churches which perpetuate the attitudes that lead to the deaths of more teens.<br /><br />Are there progressive, LGBT-supporting religious leaders, congregations, and churches? By all means, yes. Am I speaking to those churches or those people? No. <br /><br />If you found the above post to be shocking, then hopefully it accomplished what I hoped: To ask people to rethink their association to religious organizations whose ideologies may be at odds with their own. To ask people to speak up and demand that their religious organizations and leaders re-evaluate their attitudes on homosexuality. <br /><br />(con't)eshephttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03484081625693013559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-82399421269384346012011-10-19T10:34:00.407-04:002011-10-19T10:34:00.407-04:00@wicked opinion - I will respond in two comment po...@wicked opinion - I will respond in two comment posts, as my response is above the character limit.<br /><br />You seem to have a skill for extracting statements from my writing which are not there.<br /><br />I did not "blame en entire religion for one child's death." <br /><br />I clearly stated that I had no direct knowledge of Jamie's faith, or of his parents' faith, or of his church community's particular ideas about homosexuality.<br /><br />What I did say was that "Jamie's family and friends will pay tribute to Jamie's life in an church institution which undoubtedly contributed to his death."<br /><br />That is, whether or not you want to believe it, a fact. <br /><br />Here are some other facts to support the above statement:<br /><br />Statistics suggest that youth hear anti-gay remarks approximately 25 times in an average school day, or more specifically, once every 14 <br />minutes. The Gay, Lesbian, and Straight Education Network’s (GLSEN) school climate survey found that approximately 61% of LGBTQ youth reported feeling unsafe in their school environments and 44% reported being physically harassed due to their perceived sexual orientation. This unsafe sense is not just a feeling, because 1 in 6 LGBTQ youth will be physically assaulted so badly that medical attention is needed.<br />Recent research on the relationship between anti-gay bullying and suicide indicate that LGBTQ youth are at a higher risk for physical and emotional abuse at school and are at a higher risk for suicide. <br />The 2006 Massachusetts Youth Risk Behavior Survey of over 3,500 participants indicates that LGBTQ students were more than twice as likely than their non-LGBTQ peers to attempt suicide. <br /><br />One recent study suggests that anti-gay discrimination increased symptoms of depression among LGBT high school students overall and increased risk of self-harm and suicidal ideation among LGBT male high school students in particular. Another study of 7,376 middle school students found that LGBQ youth reported higher levels of bullying, anti-gay victimization, depression, and suicidality when compared to heterosexual youth.<br /><br />I'm sure we both can agree on this stuff. anti-LGBTQ attitudes and bullying can be devastating. In many instances it leads to isolation, despair, depression, and suicide.<br />(http://www.ed.psu.edu/educ/epcse/counselor-education/newsletters/CounseLion_030211.pdf)<br /><br />(con't)eshephttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03484081625693013559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-72658828103308982742011-10-18T22:37:41.694-04:002011-10-18T22:37:41.694-04:00Wow, this is REALLY reaching... to blame an entire...Wow, this is REALLY reaching... to blame an entire religion for one child's death? Really? Is this sensationalist religion-bashing supposed to be helpful in some way to suicidal gay teens? Please explain how. You start off this post with a touching story of a teen but you just can't help but insert your agenda, even when it doesn't have any bearing on this boy's life. Jamie talks about SCHOOL being his greatest source of pain, not church or religion. He doesn't even mention faith at all, YOU brought it into the discussion. <br /><br />Many people, especially those under stress and sorrow, reach for their faith as a means of support. It is his parent's decision where to have his funeral, which is for them, and I think it's disrespectful to question that. The rudeness of this is astounding. How do you think his parents would feel reading this post? His grandparents? You go so hard against religion, yet this church is going against its own tenants to perform this rite for the parents. Committing suicide is considered a sin. Many churches would refuse him a Catholic or Christian burial based on that alone.<br /><br />I take exception, as usual, to your implied "ALL" when you talk about religion, faith and church. You assume that all religions, and therefore all believers, are the same. Again, WRONG. Weren't you the one who posted the link of the PSA for the May vote a while back? And weren't there some religious leaders involved? I seem to remember a speaker with a collar on. Pretty sure he was not an atheist.<br /><br />As far as your interpretation of "Love the sinner, hate the sin" - yes, someone's sexuality is PART of who they are, but it's not ALL of who they are. So unless someone is a raging sex addict, we can separate the sex from the person having it. I don't have to agree with anyone's sexual choices if I don't want to - that doesn't change how I feel about them as a person.Wicked Opinionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09521894394212306687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1055871156862762353.post-35562124367607076382011-10-18T17:45:39.433-04:002011-10-18T17:45:39.433-04:00I think funerals are less for the deceased than fo...I think funerals are less for the deceased than for the family and friends left behind. I think our thoughts should be with this kid's parents right now, in their grief. They will most certainly be wondering what they could have done to prevent his death and I don't think it is up to anyone else to tell them where and how to do this.<br />-- thoughts from a lesbian reader who hates signing in, in order to comment.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com